Vote!

[Badger]

RageKage

Basically every point made here in this thread pretty much says "I bought the Propaganda."

Thats right! Because if you haven't bought the propaganda, you'll vote for Lando and Chewy Neatorama » Blog Archive » Star Wars Campaign Ads

Get out and vote. For Lando

[Kail]

RageKage

Basically every point made here in this thread pretty much says "I bought the Propaganda."

You will not find any true/accurate history on either candidate on the internet if it was posted within probably the last 2 years. It will be spun, manipulated or otherwise inaccurate.

A person is truly defined by their actions and not their influences. You're basically condemning a man before he has done anything, and if you're going to do that, you may as well be paranoid enough to believe that McCain could have been brainwashed while a PoW. He's a Manchurian Candidate, yo!!

...can't...help...myself...

I don't know that I'd call a voting record propaganda...or that all negative information is incorrect if it was posted within the last two years. That in itself sounds like propaganda. As I said in my original post, and you repeated here...actions make the man...and the man had actions long before two years ago...

[Lunariel]

Kail

...actions make the man...and the man had actions long before two years ago...

Certainly.

However, we have forgiven him for accepting huge campaign contributions and improperly interceding on behalf of a criminal who defrauded investors and was part of a scandal that cost Americans billions. I refuse to hold this against McCain. Indeed, if he had been remotely the person he was 8 years ago and had not swapped his positions for more conservative ones simply to gain the nomination ... OR ... If he had not chosen a complete moron for his running mate in a blatant attempted vote-grab ... I may have voted for him again.



What's that?

Wrong candidate?


OH! You must be talking about Obama's loose assosciation with a man who committed radical acts in the 60s when Obama was in second grade.

I see.

Yeah, no on here is buying into propaganda ... Just stating facts. :)

I see.

We will see what the next four years bring. Fortunately he has small shoes to fill. Taking office after the worst administration in the history of the office may leave you a LOT to fix, but at least you can't do worse

[Muljaque]

Lock this thread. No good can come of it. There are plenty of places I go to argue politics. Azeroth is not one of them.

[Lunariel]

Again, anyone not wanting to read this thread is free to not come to the thread.

We're adults.

[Melic]

True Luna, but looking at the silly arguments after the fact it just seems like no good can come of this. Only thing it can do is bred discontent.

[Lunariel]

Melic

True Luna, but looking at the silly arguments after the fact it just seems like no good can come of this. Only thing it can do is bred discontent.

You think so little of Kail and me that you would believe that a discussion like this will cause us to see each other differently? :)

This discussion will not change the way I view a friend. If you cannot talk with friends on subjects upon which you disagree, this is a bad thing. If we only talk with people who agree with us, there is stagnation of thought and no evolution of ideas.

I know Malachor to be a conservative, yet I count him among my best friends in OoC. I refuse to hold his poor judgement against him. :)

While I enjoy talking about these things, I must admit, I would rather talk about policies and philosophies than people and personalities.

I don't on any level endorse the pussification of discussions or censoring of friends in the name of being careful not to hurt feelings. If someone gets their feelings hurt by an idiot like me, I just don't know what to say. :)

[Malachor]

Lunariel

I know Malachor to be a conservative, yet I count him among my best friends in OoC. I refuse to hold his poor judgement against him. :)

I'm just waiting for Michigan to bankrupt itself for Luna to come around in his thought process to the right side.

P.S. You're not allowed to enter a State debate between GA and MI until the Lions win a game. See you in 2011.

[Lunariel]

Malachor

P.S. You're not allowed to enter a State debate between GA and MI until the Lions win a game. See you in 2011.

ouch. You know how to hurt a guy.

[Malachor]

Lunariel

ouch. You know how to hurt a guy.

I told you not to clench.

[Lunariel]

Malachor

I told you not to clench.

And Mystalia warned me about you.

[Kail]

Lunariel

Certainly.

However, we have forgiven him for accepting huge campaign contributions and improperly interceding on behalf of a criminal who defrauded investors and was part of a scandal that cost Americans billions. I refuse to hold this against McCain. Indeed, if he had been remotely the person he was 8 years ago and had not swapped his positions for more conservative ones simply to gain the nomination ... OR ... If he had not chosen a complete moron for his running mate in a blatant attempted vote-grab ... I may have voted for him again.



What's that?

Wrong candidate?


OH! You must be talking about Obama's loose assosciation with a man who committed radical acts in the 60s when Obama was in second grade.

I see.

Yeah, no on here is buying into propaganda ... Just stating facts. :)

I see.

We will see what the next four years bring. Fortunately he has small shoes to fill. Taking office after the worst administration in the history of the office may leave you a LOT to fix, but at least you can't do worse

Luna, I never said I was pro McCain. =) I agree with your above statements. As was stated by Death Dealer earlier in the thread, I simply believed McCain to be the lesser of two evils. Conservatives didn't have a candidate this year. =(

I see no propaganda. Bill Ayers (loose ties or not...who's to say) is just one piece of a picture (and Bill Ayer's beliefs haven't changed, so when he committed these acts doesn't make a difference). It's these type of anti-American individuals that Obama has surrounded himself with. I for one believe that your associations do speak to your character. Character is very important to me.

Also, his statements that the constitution is fundamentally flawed...that judges should legislate from the bench based on fairness and not law (who decides what is fair? These judges are appointed, not elected...). Even higher taxes on the wealthy and handouts to the poor (wealth creation is not attained by taxing the rich...it is attained by hard work...and the rich are cutting the checks). It's the overall picture my man...in relation to my principles.

[Kail]

Lunariel

You think so little of Kail and me that you would believe that a discussion like this will cause us to see each other differently? :)

This discussion will not change the way I view a friend. If you cannot talk with friends on subjects upon which you disagree, this is a bad thing. If we only talk with people who agree with us, there is stagnation of thought and no evolution of ideas.

I know Malachor to be a conservative, yet I count him among my best friends in OoC. I refuse to hold his poor judgement against him. :)

While I enjoy talking about these things, I must admit, I would rather talk about policies and philosophies than people and personalities.

I don't on any level endorse the pussification of discussions or censoring of friends in the name of being careful not to hurt feelings. If someone gets their feelings hurt by an idiot like me, I just don't know what to say. :)

Well said Luna. =)

[Muljaque]

Malachor

I'm just waiting for Michigan to bankrupt itself for Luna to come around in his thought process to the right side.

P.S. You're not allowed to enter a State debate between GA and MI until the Lions win a game. See you in 2011.

Hey, the Lions now have Daunte Culpepper.

[Davidson]

Kail

Conservatives didn't have a candidate this year. =(

I don't think conservatives have had a candidate (in my country either) in many many years. Even the "conservative" governments are for big spending and big governments these days.

[Kail]

I agree Dave.

[Jaga]

Muljaque

Hey, the Lions now have Daunte Culpepper.

Lot of good that did my dolphins.

[Lunariel]

The truth is, I have liked McCain in the past. Howevern in order to win the nomination he has alligned himself too closely with the philosophies of this administration. Many actions of the Bush whitehouse have been absolute abominations. I cannot imagine an administration who's top priority is not fixing these matters. That McSame-Failin (couldn't resist)do not see these as top issues is puzzling.

As for taxation of the wealthy, we can have a discussion about this for hours. However, the belief that wealth = hard work and hard work = wealth is fundamentally flawed. It is the basis for many taxation arguments and is just flat wrong.

[Kail]

"As for taxation of the wealthy, we can have a discussion about this for hours. However, the belief that wealth = hard work and hard work = wealth is fundamentally flawed. It is the basis for many taxation arguments and is just flat wrong."

Yup, you're right. We could argue about this until we die. =P I probably would have been less likely to buy into the notion myself if I hadn't experienced it first hand. =)

[Risteard]

Never underestimate the stupidity of the American people.

I for one did not jump on the Obama wagon. I think people should base their vote purely on the issues, not on how much they like a certain candidate. You can vote for a Harvard alumnus who is charismatic and "cool" or you can vote for some old guy who can barely move. But what it comes down to is that all politicians are liars (for the most part).

But history shows that a majority of presidents have a tendency to follow their party when it comes to the issues. And so in essence, you're voting for a party and not for an all-powerful leader.

So when you vote, look at all the issues that are most important to you and vote for the closest party that represents those issues. You will not necessarily align yourself to one party on all the issues, but look at those issues that are most important to you.

For me, those issues were: lower taxes, gun rights, and pro-life. Because history shows that one party better represent my view on these issues, I will typically vote for that party candidate. I will then do research on the candidate and determine if they are even worthy of my vote. Assuming they do not have a corrupt background, I would vote for that candidate.

Nonetheless, congrats goes to Obama and the first minority president. I’m glad that’s over with.

[Chroma]

Didn't McCain shoot a lawyer during a "hunting" trip? This the one reason to vote for him.

[Lunariel]

Kail

Yup, you're right. We could argue about this until we die. =P I probably would have been less likely to buy into the notion myself if I hadn't experienced it first hand. =)

We must be carefull to not assume that our experiences apply to everyone.

As long as we have random douche bags who are wealthy simple because they were squeezed out of a wealthy vagina, the wealth=work philosophy has holes.

Can one work hard and fail to attain wealth? Yes.

Can one be a lazy moron and still be wealthy? Yes.

[Muljaque]

Lunariel

We must be carefull to not assume that our experiences apply to everyone.

As long as we have random douche bags who are wealthy simple because they were squeezed out of a wealthy vagina, the wealth=work philosophy has holes.

Can one work hard and fail to attain wealth? Yes.

Can one be a lazy moron and still be wealthy? Yes.

so the logical solution is to tax inheritance severely but not much on what you build or work for yourself. But every time that gets brought up it is called a "death tax" and people get upset. quite honestly I can think of fewer harmful things for a child than knowing he is set for life and doesn't have to work a day in his life.

and I still say lock this thread.

[Kail]

Lunariel

We must be carefull to not assume that our experiences apply to everyone.

As long as we have random douche bags who are wealthy simple because they were squeezed out of a wealthy vagina, the wealth=work philosophy has holes.

Can one work hard and fail to attain wealth? Yes.

Can one be a lazy moron and still be wealthy? Yes.

These points are valid Luna. There will always be exceptions. Hard work will not necessarily mean you will be sipping margaritas on your very own yacht. However, hard work will ALWAYS guarantee gain...and I like to look at the big picture.

Even the poor (in most cases) in this great country don't truly know what it means to BE poor. They have roofs over their heads, and food in their bellies...and probably two or three TV's...

The question becomes, what philosophy works best for the overall stimulation and stability of the economy?

[Malachor]

How about we don't tax production but instead tax consumption? Problem solved.